This past summer, a series of recorded phone conversations between senior executives at Anglo Irish bank were leaked.  These tapes date back to the peak of the financial crisis in September 2008.  The release of these tapes in ongoing and has, thus far, exposed the outright criminality of the bankers involved.  The tapes show the level of fraud and manipulation that was used to swindling the Irish taxpayers into what amounted to an open ended bailout which ultimately ended in the bankruptcy of Ireland.

My next post will present a timeline of these events and analyze the content of the leaked tapes.

This post provides the transcript of several of the more interesting leaked conversations, several of which exist only in audio form – until now.

Participants

• John Bowe: Acting Director of Treasury and Director of Capital Markets
• Peter Fitzgerald: Director of Retail Banking
• David Drumm: CEO

September 18^th, 2008

John Bowe: Hello

Receptionist: John I have Peter Fitz for you.

John Bowe: Oh yeah, okay.  (Call patched in) As me granny used to say: ‘You must be therapeutic’.

Peter Fitzgerald: Eh what does that mean? Can I work the computer is it?

John Bowe: Therapeutic, therapeutic. I was just ringing you.

Peter Fitzgerald: I’m ambidextrous as well. It means I can walk on land and water.

John Bowe: You can drink, you can drink beer out of both hands.

Peter Fitzgerald: Look c’mere, what’s going on?

John Bowe: Ah Jesus…

Peter Fitzgerald: Tell me the…

John Bowe: Fun and games. yeah. We went down to the, we went down to the regulator. Did I tell you that we went down to the regulator yesterday?

Peter Fitzgerald: Yesterday? Yesterday, yeah, yesterday was fine. Yeah, I got yesterday, yeah.

John Bowe: And we basically…did I tell you we went down in the evening?

Peter Fitzgerald: No, no you didn’t.

John Bowe: Went into IFSRA and basically kind of gave it to them between the eyes and there were sort of pointing in different directions. Not us, not us but Jeez, you would want to get on that, that sounds…hmm…hmm. So we went down… and we basically said…

Peter Fitzgerald: In Central?

John Bowe: In Central yeah. And I mean to cut a long story short we sort of said look, what we need is €7 billion and we’re going to give you, what we’re going to give you is our loan collateral so we’re not giving you ECB, we’re actually giving you the loan clause. We gave him a term sheet and we put a pro note facility together and we said that’s what we need. And that kind of sobered up everybody pretty quickly, you know.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah.

John Bowe: And why do you need that and what’s happening…and Jesus oh…oh…you have certainly focused our minds. So I think.

Peter Fitzgerald: And is that €7bn a term?

John Bowe: This is €7bn bridging.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah.

John Bowe: So… so it is bridged until we can pay you back…which is never.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah, and that’s in the pro note, that’s in the terms and conditions?

John Bowe: (Laughing) That’s right. So under the terms that say repayment, we say: no.

Peter Fitzgerald: None…just none. Not applicable. Okay and what did he say? “I need a change of underwear?”

John Bowe: (Laughing) There was a bit of that, there was a bit of that [discussing meeting with regulator]. Jesus that’s a lot of dosh. Jesus fucking hell and God. Well, do you know the Central Bank only has €14 billion of total investments so that would be going up to 20. Gee, that would be seen. And how would we do that? Gee, we would need to give you. We need to. Jesus, you’re kind of asking us to play ducks and drakes with the regulations,” and we said yeah. We said, look what we are telling you is that if we get into difficulties we have 100,000 plus lump sum depositors in Ireland, all of whom would be very vocal. And I said, “take it that the other Irish banks will not be able to raise any wholesale funding for, for how long you want. So I said, “Bank of Ireland, their balance sheet is €200 billion and 45 per cent of that is wholesale, so let’s call that €90bn. And let’s say that 60 per cent of that is rolling in the next 12 months, so that’s €54 billion – take it that that won’t roll…okay. And I said you can also do a similar sum for Allied [Allied Irish Bank] and Irish Permanent. So I said that’s what is at stake because these guys, even though they’re big in our world, are minnows in the outside world.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah.

John Bowe: So I said that’s what you’re protecting. And I said you have got to. So anyway, that sort of got everybody’s attention and then we had Pat Neary. Pat Neary coming in and saying (mimicking), “C’mere lads, I just want to have a word with ya…yeah Jesus…so look c’mere, have you actually got assets, decent assets, that you can put in play? Is there stuff in there, like, that has value, you know?’

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah.

John Bowe: “And look lads you know, if you’re going for this now make sure whatever you get sorts it out. Okay? You know?”

Peter Fitzgerald: What do you mean whatever you get sorts it out?

John Bowe: In other words, whatever you get from the Regulator sorts out the issue.

Peter Fitzgerald: Oh yeah, yeah…just makes it fuckin’ happen

John Bowe: Don’t…

Peter Fitzgerald: Don’t fuck it up.

John Bowe: Don’t be coming back.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah…don’t fuck it up…yeah, yeah, yeah.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah okay. Is anyone else having these meetings with them?

John Bowe: What do you mean?

Peter Fitzgerald: Well I mean, have they had the same conversations with Permo (Irish Permanent) or have they told Permo that they’re fucked like?

John Bowe: No, I wouldn’t say so…

Peter Fitzgerald: Okay and what about the Irish Nationwide?

John Bowe: I think they’ve had discussions with them going back weeks, you know.

Peter Fitzgerald: They took their hands off the steering wheel over there and said we’re doing this now.

John Bowe: Yeah.

Peter Fitzgerald: Okay, okay…will it happen?

John Bowe: Well it has to happen. It has to happen, because if it doesn’t happen we’re going to hit a wall in the next week.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah.

John Bowe: So you tell me what’s going to happen.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, and what em…

John Bowe: We’re already in breach, you know.

Peter Fitzgerald: I know yeah, but how does this play out? What’s the playbook like? What does it look like?

John Bowe: Well, I think there’s different playbooks. I thought one playbook is that they, they decide they’re willing to put their hands in their pockets and support the financial sector, or at least support the weakest elements of the financial sector.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah.

John Bowe: I think another, and I think what comes out of that is that ultimately that gets, that will become apparent, you know what I mean? So either in your accounts or whatever, it will become apparent at some level, it will become apparent that somebody somewhere has borrowed a lot of money, you know. And there will be explanations for that or speculation, so I think what it does is it buys us time. And I would say it buys us up to our year-end results, max.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah. And what then?

John Bowe: Well, I think it’s what can we do before that, you know, so can we do a deal before that?

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah. Would it not be easier for them to stuff us into Allied?

John Bowe: Well I think, I think how this works, I think their playbook is stabilise it and then try and sort it out. And I think sort it out means sooner rather than later. So my guess is that within a few weeks they will be asking Allied to get involved or Bank.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, but do they have the capacity to get involved?

John Bowe: I don’t think so.

Peter Fitzgerald: That’s the problem.

John Bowe: I don’t think so. I don’t think they have the financial muscle themselves. They don’t have the standing in the markets themselves to get involved.

Peter Fitzgerald: True. Well they don’t now. Do you know what I mean? They might have had earlier but they don’t now. The perception of, like Bank is all over the UK press today, Bank of Ireland you know.

John Bowe: Over what?

Peter Fitzgerald: Just I mean, their, their, their interim statements, their, their..ah, just about everything. I read three or four articles about them online today in the UK.

John Bowe: Yeah.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, I have been hearing like fuckin’. I got a text to say that Allied and Bank fuckin’ play on.

John Bowe: I know yeah, yeah. I know and I know rumor, I think you were there that Bank and Permo (Irish Permanent) had done a deal, you know what I mean. The market is just rife at the moment, you know. I think the reality is that there is certainly a lot more happening than nothing at all. You know what I mean?

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, oh yeah, yeah.

John Bowe: You know what I mean. You can take it that in every bank there is boardroom discussions on where to next, you know.

Peter Fitzgerald: …wants to see us all at a quarter to one.

John Bowe: Right okay.

Peter Fitzgerald: Do you know what that is?

John Bowe: Okay. Are you going to it?

Peter Fitzgerald: No, no, I wasn’t invited. I am working here on tactical retail stuff, what we can do today, tomorrow etc.

John Bowe: Is that going on at the moment?

Peter Fitzgerald: It is yeah.

John Bowe: Okay. Jesus I hope he doesn’t decide he has to unburden himself.

Peter Fitzgerald: I know, I know. Em…there’s a lot at stake here isn’t there?

John Bowe: Yeah.

Peter Fitzgerald: How do they make it happen?

John Bowe: How does who make it happen?

Peter Fitzgerald: How do they make it happen you know?

John Bowe: Yeah, yeah. But we’re into a different phase now you know.

Peter Fitzgerald: Ah we are, yeah, and what, who did you arrive at the seven?

John Bowe: Just, as Drummer would say, picked it out of my arse, you know. Em…I mean, look, what we did was we basically said: what is the amount we can securitize over the next six months? And basically say to them: look, our problem is time; it’s not our ability to create the liquidity, the enemy is time here.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah.

John Bowe: So we can rebuild, in other words, we can rebuild the liquidity off our loan book, but what we can’t do is, we can’t do it now and the balance sheet’s leaking now.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah unless the balance sheet stabilises, then you can buy some time.

John Bowe: Yeah and that number is seven. But the reality is that actually we need more than that. But you know the strategy here is you pull them in, you get them to write a big check and they have to keep, they have to support their money, you know.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. They’ve got skin in the game and that’s the key.

John Bowe: They have and they have invested a lot. If they saw, if they saw the enormity of it upfront they might decide, they might decide they have a choice. You know what I mean? They might say the cost to the tax payer is too high. But em…if it doesn’t look too big at the outset…if it looks big, big enough to be important but not too big that it kind of spoils everything.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah.

John Bowe: Then, then I think you have a chance. So I think it can creep up.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah, yeah. They’ll give you a bit of drip.

John Bowe: Yeah.

Peter Fitzgerald: What do you think will happen?

John Bowe: What do I think will happen? I don’t know. I really don’t know. I mean I don’t think we’re an easy sell to anyone.

Peter Fitzgerald: No.

John Bowe: And the home interest should be, should be there, except that they don’t have the financial standings themselves. So do I think it’s going to be possible to offload it? No I don’t. What will it end up being? It could be breaking it up and selling individual books; it could be nationalization, you know.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah.

John Bowe: That would be fantastic.  If it was nationalization we’d all keep our jobs.

Peter Fitzgerald: It would be fantastic, wouldn’t it?

John Bowe: Yeah, civil servants, you know?

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah.  Em, but in effect that’s what it is.

John Bowe: It is.  Yeah, it is.

Peter Fitzgerald: It is.

John Bowe: But once you do that then it’s a very slow process.  You know what I mean?  It’s five years now, it will be five years then.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah.

John Bowe: You know.

Peter Fitzgerald: True, true.

John Bowe: With the other things it would be quicker, because you’re just, what you are is, you’re being prettied up for a sale and when the market comes back you’ll be sold, you’ll be offloaded then.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah.  Are they worried about what’s going on on the street?

John Bowe: Yeah, they are, they are.

Peter Fitzgerald: Did they say anything about it?

John Bowe: Well we said a lot about it and they just listened but they didn’t, we didn’t get ‘oohs and aahs’ out of them, you know?

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah, yeah.  ‘We are monitoring the situation carefully’.

John Bowe: Yeah.

Peter Fitzgerald: Ok, ok, so what now?  As in line today, tomorrow…what and see?

John Bowe: We are just going through a process now.  You know, I mean, what’s happened is that we have gone in and we have asked for the loan and we haven’t shook hands at the end of it but you know, we know they, we know they have an interest in giving it to us and they’re putting the credit pack together.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah.

John Bowe: You know, and then there’s another series of meetings to take place, so Drummer will probably be in, in with the Ministers over the weekend.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah.  That will get out.

John Bowe: I think there’s a possibility it could get out, yeah.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah, yeah.  Are they worried about the big boys?

John Bowe: No, I don’t think so.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah ok, ok.  Right, well it’s in the hands of the Gods now, isn’t it?

John Bowe: Yeah it is, yeah.  But don’t worry Peter, you know, I’ll look after things here you know.

(Laughter)

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah, I’ve a kind of headset on me at the moment.  ‘Excuse me, I’ll be with you shortly’.

John Bowe: I know that you’re just going back into your lunch now, you know, so, you know.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, well there’s a Merlot there so…

(Here there is a portion of the conversation that is missing from the tapes)

Peter Fitzgerald: Leadership now, you just need to show them leadership now, right?

John Bowe: Ah, fuck’s sake.  Well, I’m going to say to people: ‘Look, we gotta keep out, keep going here; don’t worry about things…  The bank has liquidity and we are using our liquidity now.  And, you know, the regulators, we are in contact with the regulators at the highest levels, so don’t worry about it, you know.

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.  (Laughs) Don’t bother, take the rest of the day off.

John Bowe: I don’t know.  Are you still?  I think you should say something in London or somebody should say something in London just to the guys, you know?

Peter Fitzgerald: Yeah, well maybe.  But what do you say?  Like, what is the message?

John Bowe: The message is look, keep your heads up, everything is ok, it’s a shitty world out there, every bank is going through horrors at the moment and you know.

Peter Fitzgerald: As Drummer says to me: ‘Don’t worry we’re going to be around for a long time.’

John Bowe: And then the phone went dead.

(Laughter)

September 19^th, 2008

John Bowe: But anyway I think we should, now, either we do it tomorrow morning or we do it this evening but we should sit down and go through all the, map out how this is going to play out, as well, in terms of tomorrow.

David Drumm: Em, You can do.  I told _ we would meet in here at half ten.  But ah, but em, being honest there’s not a lot to map out.  There are three strands here that are alive at the minute.  Two of them concern the Central Bank and one doesn’t.  The other one is: ‘Can I have the loan please?’

John Bowe: Yeah, that to me, that’s the first order and then I’ll be saying: ‘Ok, thanks very much, can we leave now?’  And I’ll want them to be saying: ‘No, no, come here, we’ve got something else for you to do.’

David Drumm: Yeah.

John Bowe: You know

David Drumm: No, well, we’ve already talking about the loans, what do we need to think about?  We need the fucking loans because we’re running out of money.  We gave you the term sheet.  Can we have the money?

John Bowe: Yeah, ok.

(Laughs exasperated)

David Drumm: Do ya know?  Just keep it simple.

John Bowe: Yeah I know.  I don’t know how simple it’s going to be though.

David Drumm: It’ll be stupid simple ‘cause that’s where I’m going to take it.

John Bowe: Yeah.

David Drumm: I’m going to keep asking the thick question.  ‘When?  When is the cheque arriving?’

John Bowe: Well Jesus, you know, you definitely need the donkey in the room.  You know.

David Drumm: Well, it’s worked so far.  Because if we stay in their language, nothing happens.

John Bowe: Yeah.

David Drumm: Get into the fucking simple speak: ‘We need the moolah, you have it, so you’re going to give it to us and when would that be?’  We’ll start there.

John Bowe: Yeah.

David Drumm: And by the way the game has changed because really the problem now is at their door.

John Bowe: It is yeah, yeah.

David Drumm: Because if they don’t, don’t give it to us on Monday they have a bank collapse, potentially, if the fucking money keeps running out the door the way it has been running out the door.

John Bowe: That’s it.

David Drumm: Really we’ll be sitting there kind of going we’ll be kind of a little looking a bit somber looking, sort of look, d’ya know, ‘What do you want?  How are you getting on with that loan lads?’

John Bowe: Yeah.

David Drumm: Or do you want the fucking keys now.  I can given them to you.  So I’m relaxed about it John.

John Bowe: Ok.

David Drumm: But anyway we’ll see what happens tomorrow.

John Bowe: Half ten in here for a pep talk and then off we go.  We go down in one car and into the car park.  That way we won’t be seen going in.   I’d say, well look, eh, I would say ten.  I would say ten.  We get a cup of coffee around the corner.

David Drumm: 10 o’clock it is.  You the man.

John Bowe: Okay.

David Drumm: Alrighty.

John Bowe: See you, bye, bye, bye.

September 29^th, 2008

David Drumm: J.B.

John Bowe: Hiya doing.

David Drumm: How’re ya.

John Bowe: Grand

David Drumm: Another day, another billion.

(Snicker)

John Bowe: Yeah, yeah, yeah.  I’d like to say if your friend _ was talking, he’d say: ‘A great day.  A great buzz in the dealing room.  Everybody’s tail was up.  Fantastic’.

David Drumm: Oh yeah, did I lose him a billion?

(Laughs)

John Bowe: A great day but we lost a bill.  Yeah, the money, I mean, it was another bad day but, but perversely it actually felt like it was a much better day than it turned out to be.

David Drumm: Going to prove that everything is in the head.  We’re on the front foot today.  That’s the difference, the mood is better and view towards us is better, so we just want to keep that momentum.

John Bowe: We do, yeah.  We do.

David Drumm: What, what just in terms of gameplan for tomorrow, are we going to sit down and go through what the, what’s on the table.

John Bowe: Now I sent you the document.  But that just says what we are going to be discussion.  Is it us we’re going to be talking about or is it…?

David Drumm: Well now, well now.  We don’t know.  We’re going down to meet the whole fucking shooting gallery of them.

John Bowe: Yeah.

David Drumm: I do know this.  There’s a big meeting in the Department of Finance tonight, which I am told is a kind of a pow-wow.  I assume they’re going to make up their minds what the fuck they’re doing on the basis that they can’t spend another week, next week, flapping around.  So I’m making the, jumping to the mad conclusion that the meeting of tomorrow is about discussing bringing that to fruition.

John Bowe: Yeah.

David Drumm: But I could be bitterly disappointed.  It could be another bureaucratic go nowhere meeting.  But having said that, I won’t, I won’t put up with that.

John Bowe: Yeah.

David Drumm: I’ll be forcing the agenda.  Really, we’ll be going down there with our arms swinging.  I’m very clear on the proposal and what we can and can’t do.

John Bowe: I think, I think the first order of business is sorting ourselves out.

David Drumm: No, no, that goes without saying.  Do you have the cheque here now for the loan.  That will be the first thing I’ll ask.  Ehm, have we got the collateral ready or do we need to have it ready?

John Bowe: Well, we don’t have it ready in the sense that, eh, we, we’ve never, we’ve never got into a discussion about what is it you will be giving us exactly.  You know what I mean?  What we’ve got is we’ve got collateral that we can put our hands on, and you can describe it so in other words we can identify the loans pretty quickly, we can identify the amounts of loans outstanding, we can put any covered bonds, non-eligible, and anything into it.  We can put two and a half billion of non ECB eligible stuff into it so.

David Drumm: I think it would be very helpful if you had a schedule of available collateral…

John Bowe: Ok, ya.

David Drumm: …including all those bits and bobs, such that if we get into it tomorrow, we’re not embarrassed, kind of, you known trying to explain it.  Just shove the pages, bring a few copies, shove the pages there and say: ‘Look, this is by way of tidying up, this is the collateral that’s available to you and you have your auditors in confirming you are in rude financial health and this is obviously a liquidity issue, so, em, can we have the money on Monday ‘cause we may need it.

John Bowe: Yeah, yeah.

David Drumm: That’s the line.  Well we do need it on Monday.

John Bowe: Well, I think things are, things are, we’re, we’re deteriorating more slowly than our worst case scenario, which only means, it doesn’t mean, it means that instead of the two weeks that we are going to be, or the, the week that we are going to be dead, it’s still a week, but it will be a week tomorrow, as well, or a week the next day, you know what I mean.

David Drumm: Yeah, the retail will recover slightly.  We’ve got momentum on that.

John Bowe: And the corporate will continue to go out but.

David Drumm: But there’s a bottom to that.

John Bowe: Yeah, there is, yeah.  So what will happen is that the amounts will get smaller, which means that your time from death extends out, but, you know, you are still two weeks away, you’re not, it’s not disappearing.  It’s only when we can actually start attracting net funding in that you can start talking about, you know, life.

October 2^nd 2008

Receptionist: J.B.

John Bowe: Hiya.

Receptionist: Hi, how are you?

John Bowe: Grand, grand.  Is David there?

Receptionist: Yep, one sec. (Background music)

David Drumm: John.

John Bowe: Hiya.

David Drumm: How’s it going?

John Bowe: Grand.

David Drumm: What’s up today?

John Bowe: En, ah no, making, em, nice progress.

David Drumm: Ah, you’re abusing that guarantee.  Paying too much in Germany I hear now as well.  Fucking ridiculous, John.

John Bowe: (Singing) Deutschland, Deutschland, Ubber Alles.

(Both laughing)

David Drumm: I had _ on this morning.  I just should be recording these calls for the fucking crack – or at least making notes.

John Bowe: He was on to me as well.

David Drumm: (Mimicking) ‘It’s fucking awful what’s going on out there.  I mean the fucking Germans are on to us now, David, you know.’

He’s saying: ‘Look eh, have you seen any, eh, kind of strange money market money coming through on term?’

And I said: “I’m not sure what you mean.’

He says: ‘Ya know, two year money.’ (Laughs)

And I said: ‘Eh..’.

He says: ‘ ya know, ya have to be careful here because there’s people setting us up.’

And I said: ‘Is it a bit of eh, beware of strangers bearing gifts, _.

‘Exactly, exactly.’

Setting us up by giving us money.  I don’t mind being set up that way.

John Bowe: Well, what he’s suggesting is that UK banks are setting us up by pointing money in our direction and then saying: ‘There ya go.  That’s something that was ours that they’ve got.’

David Drumm: So fucking what?  Just take it anyway.

John Bowe: Yeah.

David Drumm: Stick fingers up.  I had a pop at him this morning about Northern Rock.  I said: ‘Look, they went around with the fucking Union Jack wrapped tightly around them like a jumpsuit and grabbed all the deposits and where was out fucking Minister of Finance then?

(Mimicking) ‘I know, I know, I’m getting it from all sides here David.’

(Laughs) So I’m playing a little bit of a game of ‘oh Jesus_, look we don’t want you to be under pressure, we’re going to do the best we can.  We won’t do anything blantant, but _, we have to get the money in’.

Well we’ll have to fucking tiddly-winkle for it.

John Bowe: So I’m just saying to the guys ‘look, just be smart, don’t be stupid, get it in, don’t be overtly pumping it so that somebody can quote you but we want to get the liquidity ratios up.

David Drumm: Correct.

John Bowe: You know?

David Drumm: Correct and right.  So ok so just keep nursing along.

John Bowe: We will.  Now I have… Sorry go on.

David Drumm: Jack the rates up.  That’s what I really meant, get the fucking money in.  Get it in.

John Bowe: That’s right, just do it.

David Drumm: How do you think the cashflow’s going today?

John Bowe: I haven’t heard.  I’ve been in meetings all morning you know but, em, I’ve got our treasury policy done, customer deposits, how much within the deposit protection limit, eh how we’re going to regard institutional stuff, how mu… what the composition of the retail is going to look like, eh… short-term funding, how much term, all that sort of stuff okay?  What are we going to put our money into in terms of liquid assets.

David Drumm: Yeah

John Bowe: Do you want to see a copy of that?

David Drumm: I do, will you send it to me?

John Bowe: Yeah.

David Drumm: And then when I’ve absorbed it I’m going to meet, just sit with you and just talk about it a bit.

John Bowe: Okay.

David Drumm: Because we’ve go this board meeting coming at us fast and I’m not going to be ready at all but we just need to get the conversation going with them.  It’s more political I think than anything else.

John Bowe: Okay, I’ll send it up to you now.  Now the numbers we’re going to have a kind of senior management meeting today and I was going to throw this out and say now… just sort of set the tone you know what I mean?

David Drumm: Yeah, exactly.

John Bowe: Now so there might be some discussions around the percentages…

David Drumm: That’s fine.

John Bowe: …but you can see the intent anyway.

David Drumm: That’s fine.  I actually just want to get the thrust of it.

John Bowe: Okay.

David Drumm: Excellent.

John Bowe: Okay.

David Drumm: Cheers, see you, bye.

John Bowe: Bye.